Re: See what one wants... 13 April 2005
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Marcel Girodian,

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Re: Re: See what one wants...

Nicholas Bennett wrote:

"I wonder though why Mr Tyler quotes from Des Jarlais but omits the following:

""'We studied CD4 cell counts and percentages from 1984 to 1992 among 1,246 HIV-seronegative injecting drug users in New York City, a population at very high risk for exposure to bloodborne pathogens. Severe CD4 lymphocytopenia was rare, and there was no evidence of an increase over time. Of 229 subjects with longitudinal data, only four met the surveillance definition for "idiopathic CD4 lymphocytopenia" (ICL).' Hardly glowing evidence of support for the drug-AIDS hypothesis!

"The question dissidents have to answer is why these antibodies so effectively predict the progression to fulminant immune failure. Why don't HIV-negative people with the same risk factors have the same immune decline?"

"Lang et al actually say:

"'The three groups were 37 HIV seroconverters, 304 prevalent HIV seropositives remaining free of the acquired immunodeficiency syndrome (AIDS), and 69 men who developed AIDS during observation. Six months before seroconversion, CD4 levels were similar among HIV seroconverters and 356 seronegative controls. Within 18 months of seroconversion, mean CD4 levels fell to the level of the prevalent seropositives at study entry.'

"I do not think these are very good arguments for the drug-AIDS hypothesis. Lang et al actually is excellent evidence for HIV infection leading to immune failure.

"The question dissidents have to answer is why these antibodies so effectively predict the progression to fulminant immune failure. Why don't HIV-negative people with the same risk factors have the same immune decline?"


Nicholas Bennett blithely excludes a very important factor that explains why the Hiv + group's CD4s decline: the tremendous psychological stress and depression caused by the stigma "Hiv +" itself.

Dr. Matthew Irwin has written:

"Many of the symptoms of AIDS are either directly caused, or made much worse, by the severe, chronic psychological stress, social isolation, and negative beliefs created by the diagnosis."

"The [HIV] diagnosis itself can bring about a self-fulfilling prophecy because of the powerful negative beliefs it creates. Stress, social isolation, and negative beliefs can create the same type of immunodeficiency that is commonly blamed on HIV."

"Being diagnosed HIV-positive is perhaps one of the greatest stressors one can imagine. Not only does it raise the constant and extreme fear of a relentless deterioration and death, but it also creates a social isolation that pervades all aspects of people's lives. Social isolation, alone, has been associated with a 100% to 200% increase in mortality in several studies. The amount of psychological stress in people diagnosed HIV positive is likely to be much greater than the stress in the people in these studies."

"Studies...have shown that severe, chronic stress results in a syndrome remarkably similar to AIDS...characterized by a reduction of the number of T-lymphocytes, with special targeting of CD4, helper T cells. Severe stress has also been linked to...AIDS defining conditions, including pneumonia, tuberculosis, dementia, wasting, and death. Stress has been cause brain damage and neuronal atrophy, resulting in a dementia that mirrors 'HIV dementia'..."

Preceding from "Aids and the Voodoo Hex," "Problems with Hiv Science."

Dr. Lawrence Badgley has written:

"T4 white blood cell counts are intimately related to mental focus. One of my patients was without symptoms and went to another doctor for an 'AIDS test.' The doctor did the test, which was positive, as well as the T4 helper cell count, which was 494 and normal. Upon learning that his antibody test was positive, the patient went into a tailspin of depression and fear. One week later he returned to the doctor because of his anxiety, and his T4 helper cell count was taken again. After one week of depression and no other symptoms, his T4 cells count fell over 50% to 234."

"This intimate relationship of the mind and body raises a question about the true nature of the AIDS epidemic. It is not far-fetched to postulate that much of the immune system depression among AIDS-test- positive patients might be the result of doctors telling them that it is likely they will get AIDS and die. The brain is a giant immune system gland that operates on hope, joy, and optimism. The gland turns off in response to mental attitudes of fear and depression."

Preceding from "Healing Aids Naturally"

By pretending the psychological factor doesn't exist, those who maintain that Hiv causes Aids ignore the self-fulfilling prophecy nature of the diagnosis. Failing to take this factor into account invalidates a great deal of "Aids Science." The mind-body connection is real; we are not just vessels full of chemicals. The drug-Aids hypothesis also ignores this very strong causative factor. Disease is multifactorial and the mental component is very powerful.

Competing interests: None declared